Curious why you guys are focusing on Israel. Is this part of a networking/career plan or something?
I think EA funders are largely ignoring funding targets of $1-5k in all countries, so probably unfunded such projects are roughly evenly distributed across places where EAs are, of which Israel is perhaps 2%.
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Edo Arad
Jul 23, 2020
Approver
There are several reasons, but I agree that the most impactful research is most likely be mostly elsewhere. I don't think that in the scale we are looking for right now there is a lot of direct impact, and I view this as a learning opportunity - if this succeeds then it should definitely be scaled up globally or to other local groups, depends on the way it has succeeded.
Some reasons - we are in better position to find and help Israeli people who are only partially aligned with EA, or perhaps never heard of it, to gradually come closer to EA or a promising cause area. We want to make better connections with senior academic researchers and to generally have a good map of the relevant research spaces in Israel; we think that a good way to affect them is to nudge students a bit in the direction of more impactful research. We might have more opportunities from donors who are looking to fund Israel-specific projects.
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Shay Ben Moshe
Jul 25, 2020
Approver
It is unclear what is the primary objective of this project, especially with regards to the grantees. Are you trying to make them more engaged in EA in general? Are you trying to teach them EA kind of thinking? Are you expecting them to produce high impact research?
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Edo Arad
Aug 4, 2020
Approver
Good point. I mostly addressed the initial runs for this project, for which I actually don't think it's likely that either of these would be the most valuable. On the long term, from the experience of Effective Thesis and other conversations, I think that the most impact would come from connecting people to EA causes and helping them to start a career in those fields.
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Shay Ben Moshe
Jul 25, 2020
Approver
I would try to aim to much shorter projects in the first round. I think the longer the project, the lower the chances are for it to actually happen. This applies both to the net time of work (80-400 hours) and to the time it is spread over (up to 6 months).
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Edo Arad
Aug 4, 2020
Approver
Yea, could be. I think that would depend on the individual case, but that we should probably prioritize more certain research projects.
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Vaidehi
Jul 21, 2020
Approver
I think 10 people actually is quite a lot to manage given the uncertainties you stated earlier. I feel like 5 is a more reaonable pilot, and you can let other promising candidates know that if the pilot is successful you might do more funding
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Vaidehi
Jul 21, 2020
Approver
Especially in your pilot round, it's probably better to err on the smaller side. I don't think missing promising opportunities is that important in Round 1, because I would imagine the experimental value (e.g. is this a good idea or not) would be the most important
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Edo Arad
Jul 23, 2020
Approver
Yea, that's a good consideration. My hesitation with only five is that then it might too easily be seen as either a success or a failure just by luck.
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David Manheim
Jul 8, 2020
Approver
I think that some minimal level of coordination with key EA individuals working in the area, if not really mentorship, should be required instead of optional. (I can make sure to contact / find relevant people.)
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Edo Arad
Jul 9, 2020
Approver
Is this because you think the supervision is useful enough to be mandated or because you think that the project itself should pass through experts? (the second can be done via the research proposal process)
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David Manheim
Jul 9, 2020
Approver
For small projects like these, I think supervision and coordination / connection with an expert is likely the most valuable part in trying to get someone more involved in EA research usefully.
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Edo Arad
Jul 15, 2020
Approver
Agree. Edited to include that
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Gavin Taylor
Jul 21, 2020
Approver
In terms of small project benefits, having a grant on a student CV is very helpful when applying for later positions/fellowships.
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Gavin Taylor
Jul 21, 2020
Approver
If you just contact a central grants management group I would expect them to add this to a database (it seems too small to add to a grants newsletter), but masters/PhD students probably won't be looking through such databases for funding opportunties.
Do you have contacts in relevant departments at Israeli universities? I think you'd get better distribution if researchers forward this on departmental mailing lists.
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Shay Ben Moshe
Jul 25, 2020
Approver
I second that. I think that to find really good applicants, you need to reach many people, and the university won't do this for you by default (and 800 people of different levels of engagement probably isn't enough)
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Gavin Taylor
Jul 21, 2020
Approver
If you are just asking for a 1 page proposal it seems easier to just do this in stage 1.
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Edo Arad
Jul 23, 2020
Approver
I have concerns that this will make it more difficult for people to submit proposal if they are not sure
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Shay Ben Moshe
Jul 25, 2020
Approver
It sounds like this isn't going to fit in 1 page, and it's probably better to ask for some range between 2 and 4 or something like that.
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Edo Arad
Aug 4, 2020
Approver
Yea, that makes sense
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Shay Ben Moshe
Jul 25, 2020
Approver
I don't understand how this resonates with the next statement. What are the criteria then (besides not damaging the EA community, and, I guess, not damaging the world in general)?
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Edo Arad
Aug 4, 2020
Approver
yea, it's important to hash out the details well, but I dont think it's crucial for understanding if we plan on going on with the project
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Vaidehi
Jul 21, 2020
Approver
It might be easier to connect/encourage them to apply to Effective Thesis, where they already know the research landscape/ and have the connections
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Edo Arad
Jul 23, 2020
Approver
Interesting. I think that is less important in the grant aspect, but it is relevant in the mentoring and direction aspect.
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David Manheim
Jul 8, 2020
Approver
We should be very careful not to impose on other orgs - I would hesitate to do this without a more specific agreement on the other side. And I think that there are easier ways to make such connections on an individual basis than as a class.
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Edo Arad
Jul 9, 2020
Approver
I agree. I'll start working on these connections once we get the go ahead with this project
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Gidi Kadosh
Jun 25, 2020
Approver
I think it's very plausible that whoever runs this project would receive some minimal funding. I don't want this project to fail due to lack of management attention and not from reasons regarding to the project it self.
Plus, there might be a lot of work to be done around fundraising.
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Edo Arad
Jul 9, 2020
Approver
We can find someone to fundraise :)
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David Manheim
Jul 8, 2020
Approver
I'm happy to do proposal evaluation for (non-technical AI alignment) GCR work, especially bio, and Global priorities economics and philosophy work. For technical AI alignment, I hope we can ask +@highpriestessofelua@gmail.com for input.
For econometrics and impact evaluation, I'm capable of helping, but it would require much more of my time, and I would prefer if someone else worked on it.
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Vanessa Kosoy
Jul 8, 2020
Approver
I'm certainly willing to evaluate technical AI alignment proposals, if such are received.
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Edo Arad
Jul 9, 2020
Approver
Thank you both! I really appreciate it.
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Shay Ben Moshe
Jul 25, 2020
Approver
How are you going to manage the situation in which grantees are not going to finish their project? This will probably happen with at least some of the grantees, and I think it's a good idea to think how you're going to make as many of them as possible finish it. Also, you need to think if you are going to give the grant in beginning, after the project is done, or some combination.
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Edo Arad
Aug 4, 2020
Approver
Added previously that I think we should give the grant right at the get-go. (I find it difficult to really track people who might cheat, and I FIND it less likely anyway)
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Shay Ben Moshe
Aug 4, 2020
Approver
I didn't mean that people will cheat. I'm just assuming that some (most?) people won't finish their project, for whatever reasons.
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David Manheim
Jul 8, 2020
Approver
I'm unclear how / why this would occur.
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Edo Arad
Jul 9, 2020
Approver
I'm not sure how the process of grantmaking works. Does it count as income? Is it tax-deductible? can we give grants to people employed? Could people sue us for something silly?
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Gavin Taylor
Jul 21, 2020
Approver
I can imagine that Universities or professors object to overtly giving students salary to work on things other than their main research project. In my experience (from Australia), small 'salary' grants for students who already have a primary stipend are usually considered 'top-ups' to encourage them, but don't require them to work on anything specific beyond their main research project.
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David Manheim
Jul 21, 2020
Approver
Yes, this would be a problem for students who are already receiving grants that cover all of their time - I don't think that would describe most applicants, though. Undergraduates who aren't funded, certainly.
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Shay Ben Moshe
Jul 25, 2020
Approver
As I said above, it is unclear what are the metrics by which you are trying to measure your impact. What is it that you are trying to achieve by this project (besides gaining experience in running such projects)?
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Shay Ben Moshe
Jul 25, 2020
Approver
Should the research proposals be EA-aligned though? It was a little unclear from the grant making process.
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Edo Arad
Aug 4, 2020
Approver
Here I ment only people who are familiar with EA and consider themselves members of the community
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Edo Arad
Aug 4, 2020
Approver
regarding your question, I think that would generally be easier if someone is picking a problem from the broad EA research agenda, but if someone brings evidence that something we are not focused on might be important, that could be good to fund someone to work on it (mostly from a VOI perspective)
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David Manheim
Jul 8, 2020
Approver
I'm supposed to find out whether receiving such grants is taxable from my accountant in the near future.
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Research Grants - EA Israel Project Proposal
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