It is not just about animal welfare, it is about many causes at once, which is why it feels like it would be a great mission to align on. The words “factory farming” are misleading, because it’s really about the future of humanity. But unfortunately, I think people hear anything about farming and assume that if they don’t want to be vegan, it has nothing to do with them. But factory farming is a huge reason that we’re headed for a cliff.
And yes, just the EA people who are influencing people. I think lots of people come to EA wondering how they can make the most impact. And I think aligning on a cause for newbies is a very effective way to do that.
Yes, people are definitely doing things. But it also seems that there’s this higher level thing that everyone is worried about even if they’re not specifically working on it, and that thing is: that the world is basically set to implode (climate, deadly pandemic, war, etc.). I’m imagining aligning on that higher level goal, even if we’re all still doing other things as well (because if humanity doesn’t survive, then…oops).
Just because EA hasn’t aligned before doesn’t mean it couldn’t be very beneficial! If we could all see that our individual causes are in fact linked by one greater cause, it could be incredibly powerful.
It does sometimes feel like longtermism leans into "argument for the sake of argument," and may not be very practical for today's problems, or tomorrow's. But I also feel that way about EA (at times). I wish we could mobilize and get some big things done! I think alignment is the key to the engine.
Thank you! This is a very practical way to get people to do something. Though I will admit, I get an odd feeling about sharing it, because I feel rather dogmatic about not harming animals. I am working on this, because I know that 50% of the world eating half as much meat is more likely to happen than 50% of the world going vegan. And if the former happens, it's overall better for the animals.
Yes, I use LLMs to organize thoughts, create structure, improve flow, and offer opportunities to improve arguments and reduce redundancies. Why do you ask?
The number of animals affected is staggering. I agree, they should be considered as priority. And reducing our consumption of them can help human health and environment, too. Lots of positive "trickle-down" effects for humans.
Ack! I've had a similar experience. Crunching a snail is ::awful::. But even after my "snail awakening," I found myself (years later) putting out beer traps in my garden. I was blinded by my anger at my spoiled veggies. When I looked in for the first time to see a pile of slug bodies, I was horrified. I cried. Then I buried them.
It's wild how, even when we're really trying, and aware in other areas, things slip by.
Have you had people following up since then, with actions taken or thoughts changed? Curious about the feedback process here, and if you had to give another one, would you take a different angle?
It is not just about animal welfare, it is about many causes at once, which is why it feels like it would be a great mission to align on. The words “factory farming” are misleading, because it’s really about the future of humanity. But unfortunately, I think people hear anything about farming and assume that if they don’t want to be vegan, it has nothing to do with them. But factory farming is a huge reason that we’re headed for a cliff.
And yes, just the EA people who are influencing people. I think lots of people come to EA wondering how they can make the most impact. And I think aligning on a cause for newbies is a very effective way to do that.
Yes, people are definitely doing things. But it also seems that there’s this higher level thing that everyone is worried about even if they’re not specifically working on it, and that thing is: that the world is basically set to implode (climate, deadly pandemic, war, etc.). I’m imagining aligning on that higher level goal, even if we’re all still doing other things as well (because if humanity doesn’t survive, then…oops).
Just because EA hasn’t aligned before doesn’t mean it couldn’t be very beneficial! If we could all see that our individual causes are in fact linked by one greater cause, it could be incredibly powerful.
It does sometimes feel like longtermism leans into "argument for the sake of argument," and may not be very practical for today's problems, or tomorrow's. But I also feel that way about EA (at times). I wish we could mobilize and get some big things done! I think alignment is the key to the engine.
I appreciate that you read it, and took the time to share this thought with me.
Thank you! This is a very practical way to get people to do something. Though I will admit, I get an odd feeling about sharing it, because I feel rather dogmatic about not harming animals. I am working on this, because I know that 50% of the world eating half as much meat is more likely to happen than 50% of the world going vegan. And if the former happens, it's overall better for the animals.
Yes, I use LLMs to organize thoughts, create structure, improve flow, and offer opportunities to improve arguments and reduce redundancies. Why do you ask?
The number of animals affected is staggering. I agree, they should be considered as priority. And reducing our consumption of them can help human health and environment, too. Lots of positive "trickle-down" effects for humans.
Ack! I've had a similar experience. Crunching a snail is ::awful::. But even after my "snail awakening," I found myself (years later) putting out beer traps in my garden. I was blinded by my anger at my spoiled veggies. When I looked in for the first time to see a pile of slug bodies, I was horrified. I cried. Then I buried them.
It's wild how, even when we're really trying, and aware in other areas, things slip by.
Have you had people following up since then, with actions taken or thoughts changed? Curious about the feedback process here, and if you had to give another one, would you take a different angle?
You are on it! Thank you for sharing.