Want to Save the World? Enter the Priesthood

I keep thinking about this post.

How many EA would I like to see in the clergy? Not zero. I pretty much agree with the "portfolio approach" to careers - I think there are likely unexpected benefits of having EAs in a bunch of different careers, even ones that don't jump out as having obviously EA applications, and it's good to have some spread.

But who would I like to see in those not-obviously-EA careers? 8 years ago, nobody (including me) thought we needed social workers in EA. But I stayed with social work because it was basically the only thing I could imagine doing. It fit with so many of my interests and skills. Later it turned out that there was a useful way to apply those skills to EA. But if 8 years ago someone had said, "We should get some social workers in EA," I wouldn't have wanted random people saying, "Well, I don't feel all that interested in social work, but if that's the thing we need I guess I'll do it." I don't think that would have been good either for them or for EA.

So my best guess as to which EAs should enter the clergy is the ones who can't imagine doing anything else, or at least ones who feel pretty excited about it. If that's not you, you shouldn't try to force yourself into that mold.

This doesn't seem like a great idea to me for two reasons:

1. The notion of explicitly manipulating one's beliefs about something as central as religion for non-truthseeking reasons seems very sketchy, especially when the core premise of EA relies on an accurate understanding of highly uncertain subjects.

2. Am I correct in saying the ultimate aim of this strategy is to shift religious groups' dogma from (what they believe to be) divinely revealed truth to [divinely revealed truth + random things EAs want]? I'm genuinely not sure if I interpreted the post correctly, but that seems like an unnecessarily adversarial move against a set of organized groups with largely benign goals.

I've spent some time seriously trying to convince a devout Catholic friend of mine about EA. The problem, as far as I can tell, is that EA and the Church have value systems that are almost directly at odds. I mean, that if you take seriously their value system, the rational course of action isn't EA. At least, not in the manner meant here.

My understanding: Essentially, the Church already has an entrenched long-termist view. It's just that the hugely disvaluable outcome is a soul or souls spending eternity in hell (or however long in purgatory). In an expected value analysis, eternity is always going to win out over the whatever the life of the universe is. To convince them, then, to pursue traditional EA goals would, I think, require the extra step of motivating them to think those EA goals are more important.

I definitely agree that religious outreach is a neglected but promising area of EA community-building.

I think a big part of what makes reaching out to religious groups at least somewhat promising is that a lot of them are already trying to do good. If we focus EA outreach on the general population, or most other subpopulations that EA currently focuses outreach on, you'll likely have some people who care about doing good, and others who have different motivations. But in many religious spaces, an obligation to help others is already at the heart of what they do. And it's a lot easier to sell EA to someone who already agrees that we have an obligation to help others as much as possible. Of course, different sects and individual religious communities have varying degrees of commitment to service and doing good, but I would imagine there's some research already available on which groups are most oriented towards doing good (and if not, this is certainly doable research).

Also, from anecdotal experiences from friends and ex-colleagues as well as my own personal experience, I know a lot of agnostic/atheists who are involved in religious groups because they're looking for a community, and often more specifically, they were looking for a community oriented towards thinking deeply about the world's truths and/or doing good in the world. I think EA groups would fulfill this need for a lot of people (and perhaps relieve them from having to pretend to believe something they don't in exchange for social support).

Interesting take. I like your willingness to think about this and I agree that religion offers a lot and there are many lessons to learn. Some thoughts:

• What will one say when their congregation asks what they believe and why?
• Generally it seems EAs advise against going into harmful organisations to "change them". Have I misunderstood or why not here? Perhaps you don't think religious orgs are on balance harmful.
• In my understanding the quickest growing religious sects are conservative, which will be strongly opposed to doing things for maximising wellbeing as opposed to what the Bible/Qu'ran says.
• I think seeking the growth of more liberal branches is an interesting idea but what if that gives the "oxygen" required by more conservative groups. What if this ends up aiding the growth of conservative dogmatism?