Similarly to EdoArad, I am afraid that without some incentive/gamification structure, there would be a lack of motivation for users to edit an EA wiki. I haven’t read any science on motivations but I want to share my personal point of view. Personally, I don’t feel very motivated to edit the priority wiki because:
- I will probably receive no comments or feedback on what I wrote
- I don’t know who and when will read whatever I write there
- Even if someone reads it, it’s unlikely that they will notice that it was me who wrote it. That means that writing there won’t improve my career prospects or social status.[1] No one will come to me at the EAG or something to talk about this thing that I wrote.
Note that none of these problems apply to the EA forum which is why it feels much more motivating to write here.
I used to edit Lithuanian Wikipedia and these things didn’t apply there either because:
- I knew that many people were reading pages I was editing. It was very useful and motivating to check pageview statistics.
- There was a community, editing wikipedia felt like a collaborative project because:
- There were often discussions on talk pages and a skype channel
- I knew that admins and some other users on the Lithuanian wikipedia are looking at the recent changes page (which is much less eventful for smaller wikis) and that my new contributions will not go unnoticed. It was irrational for me to try to impress these people whom I have never met in real life but the human brain is wired to care about this kind of stuff (or at least my brain).
- People would give other people “awards” which were just pieces of html that you could put on your user page. E.g. see awards for this random wikipedia user. Receiving such awards made me feel like my effort was appreciated.
- We also had an “article of the week” which was a new article written that week that would be featured on the frontpage. I often tried to get my article featured and then it would get a lot of views. It’s almost like gamifying contributions
- Best articles on wikipedia are marked as featured or good. It was motivating to try to get my articles one of these statuses.
I’m not sure if I’m suggesting to have any of these motivation structures for an EA wiki though. It would probably not reach the critical mass where doing some of this stuff would start making sense. If it did reach the critical mass, I’d be afraid to put too many of these motivation structures in place. We don’t want EAs are spending too much time editing an EA wiki instead of doing more direct things to help the world. But maybe there is some middle ground here.
It’s probably obvious but I feel like I should clarify here that I’m not saying that I contribute to the EA forum only to get social status, etc. I do want to make an impact. But it’s difficult to motivate myself every day just by the thought that what I do might make an impact. Hence it’s good to put myself in situations where I care to do the same things that make an impact for other reasons. It’s like going to an exercise class because you know that you will be ashamed to not do exercise there when everyone around you is doing it. It’s not like you do exercise to impress those strangers, you do it to get fit, but it’s difficult to motivate yourself by the thought of getting fit alone. ↩︎
Some thoughts:
I think collectiven intelligence could be a really promising task Y if the basic structure is designed properly. I'd guess the biggest bottleneck here is funding to build the infrastructure.
The differences between meta-contributors and contributors is probably really important to understand, and may have implications for a lot of different volunteer projects - one failure mode could be if meta-contributors setting up a project and then failing to find the right people to contribute (i.e. finding people like themselves who are motivated by social rather than personal factors)
Thanks for the research links, and the summary!
I'm surprised that you think that the bottleneck is in funding, I guess that means that I overestimate the easiness and desirability of using some existing tools.
Interested in your take on it :)
Perhaps that is misleading - let me rephrase - if the solution really requires creating a new infrastructure then I'd say funding would be a bottle neck (not that funds don't exist, but they aren't always easy to get), but getting the right people to build the infrastructure would probably be a bottleneck too.
What existing tools were you thinking of?
I actually did not give that enough thought. I think using MediaWiki or Wikidot might be fine for start, and I am very fond of Roam. Notion might be great here as well. All of them require getting used to because the syntax is not straightforward, but that suffices for textual edits if there are people who go over and fix design problems. Roam is more difficult because it is... different.. and because it is less mature. Roam being in it's starting phases might actually be a good thing, because it's development can probably shift to the needs of the EA community in this case if the EA Wiki will be hosted there (Roam Research received a grant from the Long Term Future Fund)
That is all to say that I think a basic wiki infrastructure might be fine for start, if there is a good roadmap and support from the community. I assume that markets and fancy prizes can wait for later or be hacked into existence, but maybe that should be in the design from the start 🤷♂️
That's very useful, thanks! Pingbacks especially.
Wow, so we even have some theory on that. And motivation from the paper looks aligned with EA values.
Completely agree. And also really appreciate your science-based approach. We definitely should discuss it if more of us agree that some platform for open contributions is needed.
+1
Yep! We also have such list in EA Denmark though ours is much simpler. And indeed, it was one of the things that pushed me to ask this question.
I was thinking a lot about GitHub-like structures. It's too complicated for general knowledge, but designed pretty well for more complex domains. For example, if a group works on something like OpenPhil Cause Reports, where producing each piece of information takes long time, and also work of the beginners must be validated by more experienced users. In such cases system of branches allows splitting publishing-ready information from work in progress, issues allow to contribute for those who isn't skilled enough to create product, but has enough experience to note a problem. And so on. But that's just one of possibilities.
Not sure about that. Different kind of information requires different types of knowledge bases. And here as an example we can take forums, StackOverflow and wikipedia. As far as I understand, if you want to share information about a topic, where some consensus can be found over time and once found is not expected to be changed quickly, then you want wiki. So, someone writes an article with main ideas about the topic and others polish it up (which is kind of impossible on forums). Another situation is if your domain changes too quickly (such as programming languages). Then there is no reason in having overhead for having nicely written articles about every aspect of it. At maximum you'll need to have some blog posts. And the third popular case is asking for personal opinion: it can be either some tips and hacks (StackOverflow has plenty) or just discussion of some ideas like we do know. And this is impossible on wiki.
My impression is that in EA community we lack well-organized up-to-date information, which would represent some kind of consensus instead of a bunch of personal opinions. Your list "how to do the most good" is one example of a thing, which can't be implemented on forum. For such lists, suggestions to EA Hub resources, which @cafelow mentioned would solve the problem. But in general I wouldn't expect them being as effective as wiki.
Hah, if you have problems with incentives, just add some markets! :)
Re Github-like structures, I think that Google Docs can be sufficient for most cases. Instead of branches, you have non-published docs. And using a wiki page instead of issues might be fine.
I agree with your analysis of knowledge bases, thanks for clarifying that! I take back the suggestion of doubling down on the forum mostly because it seems difficult to properly keep the information updated and to have a clear consensus.
Also, I found that I tend to access Wikipedia mostly as a search result, and sometimes go deeper if there are inner links that interest me. This means that we only need the information to be accessible by search, and to be good at referencing further material. This can be possibly implemented adequately on the forum (but requires better search, better norm for writing information, and a better norm of referencing to other materials, perhaps in the comments).
And this is an interesting experiment in a mechanism designed to improve incentives for collective knowledge production.
(accidentally commented twice)